Transcript - 'Mosque in Athens' Debate (2012)

ꕤ Transcript SOURCE https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tNo59pQcyKE 'Mosque in Athens' Debate  27 Nov 2012 Douglas Murray British writer, journalist and commentator atheist ('cultural Christian', formerly Anglican) Douglas Murray's comments re Islamic extremism in Netherlands mean that he has to have a police guard when travelling there. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Douglas_Murray_%28author%29 TRANSCRIPT [for quotations, confirm audio] 25:39 Douglas Murray There, that's better.  Apologies for not being able to speak Greek and for not being able to work the microphone. It's very nice to be in Athens. I want to open by thanking the organisers for inviting me, for inviting our side, particularly thank, obviously, Intelligence Squared and also the British Council. I should also say at the outset, I also feel rather sorry for our opponents tonight, who have been appallingly set up, clearly, by the motion that we have been given. The motion that we are debating tonight is not whether or not the mosque should be built, the motion is that only good can come from building it. And it seems to me, that the only people who could possibly believe that are people who are extraordinarily naive, people who are extraordinarily ignorant, or something altogether worse. Now, I'm not a cultural relativist. I don't believe that all civilisations are equal.  I don't believe all cultures are equal.   That doesn't mean I don't believe we can't all get along. But I don't believe that we have to pretend, among other things, in debating things like this evening's motion, that we do not ourselves in Europe have a history that we would wish to defend, a culture we might wish to be proud of and to protect, and even to make value judgements about other ideas, other religions, other cultures. Now, it's my belief that Europe is based on the fundamental principles of Judeo-Christian civilisation and of Greek culture, and from this wonderful symbiosis of values, the history of Europe, the culture of Europe, has emerged. I believe, furthermore, that states have the right to decide, to at least have a say, in their own future; that waves of illegal immigration do not mean that cultures which have had such immigration immediately have to concede to the incomers. It's also, I should stress at the outset, is an important debate to have, because there is a problem that Europe is experiencing with Islam.  And I think we have to tackle this head-on. Islam is a very, very complex thing. Let nobody say that we on this side are essentialising Muslims, or generalising about Muslims, or aren't aware of the huge variety of practices and beliefs within Islam. But to create a massive centre at public expense in Athens at this moment should at least be questioned. We should at least be able to address whether or not it would seem to us to be like a good idea. Let me give you an example -- from my own country, from Great Britain -- of this kind of thing going on, because in Britain we have many mosques, many Muslim organisations are funded by the government, and I wanted to give one example of the sort of thing which the Athens mosque might yet become on this benevolent idea that if the government is behind it, only good can come from it. There's a mosque in London called East London Mosque.  The London Muslim Centre is attached to it. It has received a lot of public funding.  It's routinely hosting all sorts of great dignitaries, from the British political class -- and outside. The American Ambassador in London recently graced it with a visit.  The shadow Justice Minister recently graced it with a visit.  The Mayor of London, Boris Johnson, graced it with a visit.  Even Prince Charles, the heir to the throne, is a regular. There's a veritable drive time at this mosque.  It's hard to get to it for the number of dignitaries cars that are forever drawing up outside. But is it the case that despite all of these grand official benedictions, it is a place from only which good can come? No.  Not at all. You just have to look at the type of people who preach there. I'm just looking over the last few years. Recently, Sheikh Khalid Yasin a popular preacher, who also preaches the virtues of public beheading, saying that it would be a grand thing to have in Britain because it would teach people not to murder if they saw heads rolling down the streets. It's hosted Sheikh  Al-Sudais, who believes that Jews should be annihilated. It's hosted Yasir Khadi, who's a holocaust denier. It's hosted among others, Bilal Philips, who is a proponent of suicide bombing. And it's also, perhaps most famously, hosted Anwar al-Awlaki, a man who is currently on the kill or capture list of that notorious hawk, President Obama. Just earlier today in London, a young man called Rajib Karim, was convicted of an attempt to bring down airlines -- blow up airline planes -- with the assistance of that man, Anwar al-Awlaki. So, it's clearly not the case that just because officialdom is involved that mosques are centres of wonder, loveliness and peacefulness, a sort of Anglican Church meets the Green movement. [audience laughter] It's also, I think worth noting, one or two of the oddities of Islam internationally at the moment and particularly in this regard. Islam, when it is in a minority, is extremely good at talking about tolerance. In a minority, Islam loves to talk about the tolerance that people must show towards the minorities. One of the things, however, if you look around the world -- and I'm sure I don't need to tell you this -- is that whenever Islam is in the majority, minority rights are nowhere to be seen. It's a one-directional talk of minority rights. When Islam is in a minority, it talks of the importance of human rights. When it is in a majority, those human rights -- including the most basic human rights, like the rights of women to be considered equal beings -- are thrown right out the window. And I think we also have to bear in mind that there is a problem in the world today of the direction in which organised Islam across the globe is growing. I think that there are many problems in the religion, as in most religions. Most religions have problems of some type to get over. But in Islam there is a particular problem of a magnetic literalism, which keeps on drawing people back to the violent tenets of the faith. You'd better hope, ladies and gentlemen, that your mosque here is a first internationally and that nobody with any unpleasant statements -- any unpleasant ideas -- could possibly come to it. You'd better hope that it's not like the US, for instance, where the Muslim Brotherhood movement, for instance, which Tariq's grandfather founded, recently was unearthed as saying that the job of Muslims was to make a civilisation conquest in the West. You'd better hope, ladies and gentlemen, that nobody would agree with, for instance, with Prime Minister Erodogan -- not a minority, not an unimportant figure -- when he says the mosques are our barracks, the domes are helmets, the minarets are bayonets and the faithful are soldiers. And, finally, you'd better hope that one of the most influential men today in Islamic terms, Sheikh Yusuf al-Qaradawi wouldn't have anything to get near this mosque -- any excuse to get near it -- because he said just recently in a fatwa on the signs of victory of Islam:      It means that Islam will return to Europe as a conqueror and a victor, after having been expelled from it twice.  Once from the south from Andalusia and a second time from the east, when it knocked several times on the doors of Athens. Ladies and gentlemen, you don't have to be naives and you don't have to be ignorant to notice that knock is happening again, and you don't have to open the door to it. Thank you. [applause] 34:35 ___________________________________ Khalid Yasin https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Khalid_Yasin Sheikh  Al-Sudais https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Abdul_Rahman_Al-Sudais Anwar al-Awlaki (al-Qaeda), Yemen cause of death:  Hellfire missile https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anwar_al-Awlaki Rajib Karim - British Airways terrorist plot http://www.theguardian.com/uk/2011/feb/28/british-airways-bomb-guilty-karim Dr. Abu Ameenah Bilal Philips  - Jamaican-born Canadian https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bilal_Philips Said Ramadan Egyptian  - major figure Muslim Brotherhood {son-in-law of Muslim Brotherhood's founder, Hassan al-Banna} {father of Tariq Ramadan, prominent Egyptian-Swiss academic / Prof. Contemporary Islamic Studies} https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Said_Ramadan Tariq Ramadan prominent Egyptian-Swiss academic Prof. Contemporary Islamic Studies Oxford lecturer Islamic Studies {MA in Philosophy & French literature / PhD in Arabic and Islamic studies} advisor to the EU on religious issues sought for advice by EU on commission on "Islam and Secularism" 2005 - UK government task force European Muslim Network - founder & President (Brussels-based think-tank that gathers European Muslim intellectuals and activists) Govt Prohibition List 2009 - persona non grata in Tunisia, Egypt, Saudi Arabia, Libya, Syria. Persona non grata in Israel. prolific writer authored over 30 books, mainly in French https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tariq_Ramadan Recep Tayyip Erdoğan, Prime Minister of Turkey since 2003 "The mosques are our barracks, the domes our helmets, the minarets our bayonets and the faithful our soldiers..." 1998 conviction & minor jail-term for inciting religious hatred. [Isam-Watch] *Switzerland banned minarets in 30 November 2009 referendum, claiming that it's a symbol of Islam's political domination.  [Isam-Watch] Sheikh Yusuf al-Qaradawi Egyptian Islamic theologian radical Muslim Brotherhood ideologue based in Qatar http://archive.adl.org/nr/exeres/788c5421-70e3-4e4d-bff4-9be14e4a2e58,db7611a2-02cd-43af-8147-649e26813571,frameless.html ---------------------- ꕤ ---------------------- ꕤ

Video - Mosque in Athens, Full & Related Articles

ꕤ Article SOURCE 'Mosque in Athens'  Debate - Intelligence Squared FULL VERSION 27 Nov 2012 Transcript Douglas Murray Link  |  here Last Updated: Tuesday, 18 July 2006, 11:24 GMT 12:24 UK Athens Muslims to get a mosque By Andrew Burroughs BBC News, Athens Ottoman mosque turned into museum This Ottoman era mosque is now a museum Plans for the first mosque in Athens since Turkish rule under the Ottoman empire have been given the go-ahead by the Greek parliament. Over recent years immigration has brought hundreds of thousands of Muslims to the Greek capital. But while freedom of worship is guaranteed by Greece's constitution as a member of the European Union, proposals for a new mosque have proved controversial in a country whose population is 96% Greek Orthodox. There are mosques dating from Ottoman times in the old part of Athens known as Plaka. The Fethiye or victory mosque dates back to 1458. But today these buildings are for tourists not for Muslim prayers. One is now a museum of Greek folk art. Athens is the only EU capital without a purpose-built place of worship for its Muslim population. The city's 200,000 or so Muslims have been meeting in disused basements and whatever space the community can find. Technically these buildings lack proper legal permission to function as places of worship, though the city authorities, aware of the problem, have allowed meetings to continue while a solution is sought. Demonstrations In the run-up to the Olympics, and under pressure to portray Greece as internationalist and conciliatory, the then socialist government chose a site for a Saudi-sponsored mosque and Islamic centre east of Athens to be visible from the international airport. That provoked demonstrations by nearby residents of the staunchly conservative town of Peannia. Today there's a small Greek Orthodox chapel on site, built to commemorate the protests which thwarted the mosque proposal. On special occasions a bell is rung, and on the hilltop a cross now defiantly looks towards the airport. "We are Orthodox Christians here," says Angelo Kouias, a Peannia resident, involved in the protests. "We believe that when you arrive at the frontier of Greece it would be better to see a church to symbolise our country rather than a mosque." "We don't want another Kosovo here close to Athens," says Dr Athanasius Papagiorgiou, a surgeon and president of the group which opposed the plan, the religiously conservative Association of St John. "Kosovo used to be a centre for the orthodox faith, and today it's nothing." Lost privilege Professor George Moustakis represents a different face of orthodoxy - a campaigner for interfaith understanding who joined a petition in favour of a mosque 17 years ago. "I've always opposed the connection of church and state here in Greece, which has meant the church took the decision about other denominations and other faiths and their buildings for worship," he says.  [But for all his airy-fairy ideals, he is paving the way to connection of Islam to state] "Parliament has now voted and the church lost that privilege. So there is no problem about the mosque, the government supports it, so does the Orthodox Church."  [All sold out to the Saudis?] With the church veto gone and support from the current centre-right government, Naim El Ghandour - who in daily life imports high fashion fabric designs - is the man coordinating plans for a new mosque to be built in the north of Athens. "The Muslims of Athens are Greek tax-payers and we have a right to pray in a respectful building," he says "We're asking the government for financial help. We're not looking for foreign sponsors, this will be a Greek mosque for Greek Muslims." [Solution:  live in Saudi Arabia & pray there.  Greeks are not Muslims.  All taxpayers are not equal.  No such thing as 'Greek Muslims'.  What a scam.  Greeks do not deserve the imposition of Islamic culture, religion and political power upon native Greeks, hundreds of years after fighting off Islamic invasion.] The saga of the Athens mosque finds echoes elsewhere in Europe. The city of Grenada in Spain has just witnessed the opening of its first new mosque since the 15th Century when the Spanish re-conquered the Iberian peninsula from the Moorish Islamic rulers who built the historic mosques and palaces of Andalusia.  [Sacrilege.  I'm not religious, but I see this as a desecration.  A desecration of European territory, history, culture and society.] The new mosque opened for worship only after two decades of objections from the local authorities on planning grounds. And in Italy a mosque planned for seven years in Colle di Val d'Elsa in a picturesque corner of Tuscany has divided the local community. There the local authority supports the need for a mosque but there have been objections from residents. It is a scenario likely to be repeated around the EU as the need for immigrant labour draws into the community those of a different faith, who then naturally wish to take up their equal right to a place of worship. [What, Latin America hasn't a population that would work in Europe?] http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/europe/5190256.stm Published December 14th 2013 08:51pm Greek neo-Nazi party protests Athens mosque Shouting 'Greece belongs to the Greeks' and 'No mosque in Athens,' Golden Dawn's supporters stage rally Some 700 members and supporters of Greek neo-Nazi party Golden Dawn protested Saturday against the construction of Athens' first official mosque, the state-run Athens News Agency reported. Shouting "Greece belongs to the Greeks" and "No mosque in Athens", protesters gathered in the Eleonas neighborhood in central Athens where the mosque will be constructed, according to the agency. Lawmaker Eleni Zaroulia -- the wife of Golden Dawn leader Nikos Michaloliakos -- and three more of the party's elected deputies reportedly participated in the protest. Michaloliakos is currently in pre-trial detention, charged with running a criminal organisation following a musician's murder by one of the group's supporters in September. In November, the government announced that a Greek consortium had been chosen to lead the construction of Athens' first mosque, 13 years after plans were first announced. Five previous attempts to find a business group to back the project had failed. Athens is one of the few European capitals without an official mosque, but in recent years several non-official places of worship have appeared in the Greek capital thanks to an increasing numbers of immigrants from countries such as Pakistan. [One of the few European capitals without an official mosque?  No wonder the clerics are issuing victory fatwas.] In 2011, the Greek government was forced to adopt a law ensuring the mosque's construction. But concerns over where to place the mosque and protests from the far right led to the failure of five contract tenders. The only official mosques in Greece are situated in the northeast region of Thrace, where a minority group of Muslim Turks live. http://www.i24news.tv/en/news/international/europe/131216-greek-neo-nazi-party-protests-athens-mosque Construction of First Mosque in Athens to Start Soon By Philip Chrysopoulos - Aug 5, 2015 Construction of the first mosque in Athens will start as soon as final details of the much-delayed project are ironed out and the building permit is about to be issued. It has been seventy years since it was decided to build a mosque in Athens. The delays have been a constant source of tension with the Muslim world. The Organisation of Islamic Cooperation has been highly critical of the delays, with the Minister of Culture, Education and Religious Affairs Aristides Baltas stressing that these delays are used to defame Greece. ['seventy years' must be a mistake.  must be 7 years. / So Greece is being *bullied* into mosque building, given 'tensions with the Muslim world'.  Greece, tell them you'll comply when there's a magnificent church of victory erected in Mecca.] In recent years the tender for the construction had been repeated five times and a successful bidder was selected in November 2013. The project has a budget of 964,000 euros and it will be constructed on a plot of land owned by the Greek Navy. It is located in the area of Eleonas in Athens where a former Navy workshop building will be converted into a mosque. The last detail remaining is the settlement of a stream that should not cause any more delays. The building of the Athens mosque is one of the priorities of the SYRIZA government and Alexis Tsipras has promised that he will complete it. The project, however, is met with many reactions from the Greek Orthodox Church. Metropolitan Bishop of Piraeus Seraphim has appealed to stop the construction. http://greece.greekreporter.com/2015/08/05/construction-of-first-mosque-in-athens-to-start-soon/ ---------------------- ꕤ ---------------------- COMMENT About to watch the full video, having seen a clip of Melanie Phillips speak on the subject.  Initial impression:  Western civilisation is finished.  Europe is finished. The British Council is in the service of Saudi Arabia. Project 'Our Shared Europe' is a joke.  Especially coming from a nation that has allowed this to develop:  Britain White Flight Muslim Enclaves in Britain Sharia Courts / No Go Areas, Britain http://www.gatestoneinstitute.org/5177/no-go-zones-britain Neocon agenda British Council propaganda serves the interests of  those that do not have to live with the consequences of their demented policies -- yet. Europe permitted itself to be flooded by Muslim immigration and has dutifully permitted construction of mosques, while Athens is the sole remaining European capital that hasn't capitulated to Saudi Arabia -- and that presumably includes even Moscow, which recently opened a mosque. Greece is being bullied into constructing an Islamic edifice, despite the obvious and understandable opposition of the Greek people. Saudi Arabia is behind this mosque project and is most likely behind all the mosque projects in Europe, as radical Islamic clerics issue fatwas declaring victory of Islam over Europe. The EU is an organisation that promotes the interests of foreign entities and the destruction and Islamisation of Europe. Europe needs to reconfigure -- fast. Putin Opens New Mosque in Moscow Amid Lingering Intolerance By NEIL MacFARQUHARSEPT. 23, 2015 President Vladimir V. Putin of Russia spoke on Wednesday about Islam and the war in Syria at the opening of Moscow’s largest mosque. By REUTERS on Publish Date September 23, 2015. Photo by RIA Novosti/Reuters. Watch in Times Video » MOSCOW — Against rather long odds, including a hostile mayor, a vocal constituency irritated by Muslim rituals, and criminal rackets loath to see valuable real estate lost to charitable organizations, Moscow inaugurated a glittering, elaborate new mosque on Wednesday. It took 10 years to come to fruition, in fact. The opening was a singular event in a city where a wave of bombings by Muslim extremists that started around 2000 generated an animosity toward the faith that never entirely abated. Flanked by President Recep Tayyip Erdogan of Turkey and Mahmoud Abbas, the president of the Palestinian Authority, President Vladimir V. Putin used his speech at the inauguration of the mosque, which he called the biggest mosque in Europe, to emphasize that Russia would develop its own system of religious education and training to counter extremism. http://www.nytimes.com/2015/09/24/world/europe/putin-opens-moscows-most-elaborate-mosque.html?_r=0 Hey, Vlad, this the same Recep Tayyip Erdogan of Turkey who declared and was convicted & imprisoned in 1998: mosques are our barracks, the domes are helmets, the minarets are bayonets and the faithful are soldiers. What a f*cking sell-out for gas pipes, Russia. And it's destined to blow up in your face spectacularly. Russia thinks it can appease Islam with 'religious education and counter-extremism training'. Just as Europe is finished, Russia is finished. Bibi, nuke the planet.  lol ꕤ

Video - Melanie Phillips Islam in Europe

ꕤ Video SOURCE https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bH6QO9MfaH4 Melanie Phillips Islam in Europe 13 Jul 2011 Rough Summary {recommend:  check against audio} Pew Poll Britain least Islamophobic of all European nations that were studied & Britain nevertheless where Muslims hated their host country the most. Real religion has become individualism.  Nonetheless, a great desire for spirituality. Spirituality without the church, without organised religion & moral codes. Morality has been privatised. What's right for me, is the basis for moral and cultural relativism. Relativism involves no judgement to be permitted of people's lifestyles; the development of multiculturalism and victim culture, based on the doctrine that the values of the majority by definition are illegitimate, because they exclude the minorities. Under the doctrine of relativism, there is no objective truth; everything is a matter of opinion, because my values are the equal of your values and therefore it is merely my opinion versus your opinion. Under the doctrine of relativism, there is no objectivity; there is no truth. This has given rise to a moral and social anarchy, in which Britain is rapidly retreating to a pre-modern age of irrationality. Having disaggregated [divided] truth, we are no longer able to use the reason that bases itself on truth. Yet we make a fetish of reason. It is in the name of reason -- scientific reason, also known as empiricism -- we have exiled religion and declared that god is dead because the biblical stories are merely primitive superstition, as they don't correspond to the dictates of reason as defined by empiricism. Believe in a wide range of crap. Complete disintegration of rationality, belief, cultural identity, morality, spirituality and religion has created a cultural vacuum. Britain, Islamists filling the vacuum by: 1)  terrorising population through terror; 2)  converting the most vulnerable:  criminals, mentally disturbed, young who look for meaning beyond materialism.  3) exploiting victim culture, which has arisen out of doctrine of multiculturalism to claim that in the interests of 'equality' they must have preferential treatment in the public square, backed up by the threat of terrorism.  Intellectual elite in Britain has fallen for this hook, line & sinker, unlike the public, who most certainly have not.  But our intellectual, political and security establishment in large measure is saying, instead of Muslims in Britain being treated on the principles of equality like any other minority, they have allowed and, indeed, condoned and encouraged, the steady encroachment of Islam into the public sphere. So Britain now has earnest discussions by UK's most senior lawyers of the extent to which Islamic law can and should be permitted to encroach into the field of the English common law, although the principles of Islamic law are inimical to the English law and to the canons of Western society and British society. Archbishop of Canterbury stated:  entirely proper for British Muslims to have recourse to sharia family law alongside English common law. He was somewhat surprised by the explosive reaction he provoked. What he was saying we should have no fear of as a hypothetical enticement for the future was already happening, in spades. In Britain, there's a steady development of Muslim enclaves which are governed informally by parallel jurisdiction of sharia law, a kind of embryonic state within a state. Britain already turns an official blind eye to such things as cousin marriage, genital mutilation of women, honour violence, and polygamy. Indeed, Britain is now, as a state, encouraging and condoning polygamy, because Britain is now giving welfare benefits to the multiple wives of Muslim men. Britain's Prime Minister has said that Britain should become the global centre of sharia finance. What is not understood, is that this will institutionalise Islamism in Britain. It has come as a shock for some of Britain’s banks to find that on their sharia boards advising them about their sharia finance arrangements, sit those who are not wholly unassociated with Islamic terrorism and with al-Qaeda. Sharia, as understood by Melanie Phillips, does not prohibit the charging of interest.  Sharia merely prohibits exorbitant rates of interest. Sharia loans will entail the Islamisation of borrowers, Phillips states. British establishment refuses to see all of this and refuses to accept that religion is at the heart of the problem, and refuses to accept that what Britain is facing is an Islamic jihad. British establishment has instead accepted the Muslims' own assertion that what we are facing in terms of terror is nothing whatsoever to do with religion and if anyone says that Islam is a religion of violence, they will kill them. British establishment thinks that by seeking to accommodate this Muslim narrative of encroachment into the public sphere, they will draw the Muslim sting and get the Muslim community on-side, they will draw the sting of anger against Britain, they will turn jihadists into model citizens, and they will separate the community from al-Qaeda. British establishment think that the Islamic religion in the form of the Muslim Brotherhood is an antidote to al-Qaeda -- an antidote to terror.  They think the Muslim Brotherhood is a counter-radicalisation movement. As a result, they are using the Muslim Brotherhood and bringing it into the heart of British establishment, because they fail to understand that what Britain is facing is a pincer movement of Islamism being used against British society, not just through terrorism but also through cultural attack. Britain is seeing Leninist Islamism in the form of al-Qaeda, as well as Gramscian Islamism in the form of Tariq Ramadan and cultural Muslim Brotherhood onslaught, which corresponds to and is using the Gramscian onslaught on the basic tenets of Western civilisation through such things as the capture of the intelligentsia, the capture of the universities, the capture of the establishment, the capture of the civil service, the destruction of such things as family and nation, and substitution of the values of the excluded and transgressive for the values of the normal. That is the Gramscian project.  It has succeeded in Britain absolutely to the letter.  And the Islamists are coming along and Islamising Gramsci.  That's what Britain has. The government does not see this, so Britain now has Muslim Brotherhood people at the centre of government, advising government on how to combat Islamist extremism. Melanie Phillips has sat in defence establishment seminars, where she has seen hard-bitten people from the security establishment sitting lapping up Islamits bamboozling them with a sanitised and highly selective version of Islam. Melanie Phillips states that she knows that the British police are giving sensitive security information to Muslim extremists who are on their liaison groups with the community, which are not vetted in case they upset the Muslim community and they are asking permission of these people before they conduct raids. What this is doing is undermining the true moderate Muslims in Britain, of whom there are certainly some, but not by any means as many as is said to be, but they do exist. Cardinal Pell painted a benign and optimistic picture of relations between the non-Muslim and Muslim minority in Australia. Melanie Phillips makes a couple of points, which Pell did not fully acknowledge: 1.  Australia has very few Muslims compared to Britain and what there is in Europe, and that of course makes a considerable difference. 2.  Key thing about Australia is that this relatively happy state of affairs follows the incredibly hard line taken by John Howard and other ministers in that government, who basically said in terms, repeatedly:  this is the line we are drawing, we are a European Western society, you live here on our terms, or else you go -- and by the way, we are not letting a lot of you in and like it or lump it, these are our terms.  This is our society, this is our culture, you are welcome to take part in it, but on our terms. Melanie Phillips states, this is what has to happen.  Britain has to draw the cultural line in the sand. "The British Muslims say to us, we want equality.  We are a minority, we want equality.  And the establishment, because its so bamboozled by multiculturalism, thinks that equality means equality of the minorities with the majority.  But it doesn't.  The deal since the establishment has been that the majority upholds its own society -- and in the case of Britain and the West, tenets of liberalism, of tolerance of the disconnect between religion and the public square -- and that all minorities are treated the same *as each other* within that. In other words, they are all free and welcome to practise communities of faith, but where those faiths may conflict with the dominant values of the majority, those values must give way. ... In terms of the public sphere, it's ours:  you do not colonise it. So not one inch will we give to sharia, because we give it to no other minority." Britain has gone hell for leather in the opposite direction and that is why Britain is the most tolerant nation in Europe towards its Muslim minority, and it is the most hated by that minority. Antonio Gramsci https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Antonio_Gramsci Further Video Melanie Phillips on the threat of radical Islam 11 Mar 2015 https://youtu.be/S7qOemB2l9E?t=1680 Terrifying conclusion. Hard to weigh up how seriously to take Melanie Phillips, as she is very bound up in defending Israel -- ie Israel can do no wrong -- & it sounds like the US can't do wrong either (eg 2007 videos I just looked at). That could be unimportant, but it could also be a significant thing. The threat is probably real (but not necessarily for the reasons she thinks).  The rest I don't buy. Israel never gets bad press, but from the way this lady's talking in the videos I've seen, you'd think the press was crucifying Israel. Israel is always treated as an exception:  Tzipi Livni arrest warrant ignored; over 120,000 signature petition to arrest Netanyahu not discussed in UK parliament, contrary to own rules;  the "Israel has a right to defend itself" constant refrain, as Israel was pounding Gaza (which is like an open prison); the massive amount of aid Israel receives from the US; the military aid Israel received from Germany; the considerable amount of kowtowing to Israel and supporters of Israel that the West seems to do, are just some of the things that come to mind. ---------------------- ꕤ ---------------------- ꕤ

Dresden Germany - Anti-Immigration Rally

ꕤ Article SOURCE http://news.yahoo.com/thousands-attend-german-rally-against-refugee-influx-194146372.html Thousands attend German rally against refugee influx AFP By Coralie Febvre 23 minutes ago Dresden (Germany) (AFP) - Thousands of far-right protesters, many wearing T-shirts that read "refugees not welcome", gathered in Germany Monday to condemn the government for allowing an unprecedented migrant influx. [Note:  they are not a 'right-wing' group.  site here:  https://www.facebook.com/pegidaevdresden] With Europe's biggest economy expecting to take in up to one million people fleeing war and poverty this year, anger has flared among anti-foreigner groups and backers of the anti-Islamic "Patriotic Europeans Against the Islamisation of the Occident" (PEGIDA).  [1.5 million, according to a leaked govt document ... where Germany has previously been taking 250,000 per annum.  Hello?  And even that figure is conservative, in my view.  Add to that the families that will be imported and the German government's own leaked estimate is brought up to 7.36 million non-European immigrants -- here.  I'm going to wager that is a very conservative estimate.] "Merkel is guilty, commits ethnocide against the German people," read one banner at the rally in Dresden, the historic city in the former communist East where PEGIDA emerged about a year ago and is now hoping to rekindle the movement.  [And the West of Germany is formerly Nazi German, so does this explain the German govt decision to ride roughshod over the wishes of ordinary Germans?  The press is forever bring up that PEGIDA emerged in the East.  Hey, maybe they're not as brainwashed as the utterly defeated and assf*cked West Germans under the British & US thumb, and maybe they therefore retain some sense of national and ethic identity.] At their peak the xenophobic rallies attracted 25,000, but they fizzled early this year after PEGIDA's co-founder Lutz Bachmann, 42, sparked public uproar with Facebook selfies showing him sporting a Hitler moustache and hair-do. [They're patriotic rallies you c*nt propagandists at Yahoo AFP.  Some guy takes a funny photo at the hairdressers and this sparks such an uproar that he steps down (from recollection), and this is 'noteworthy' this far down the track?  lol  More f*cking smear.  The press is predictable.  Let's not forget Prince Harry dressed as a Nazi (does that make him a Nazi?) ...  and there's also the video of the Queen, the Queen Mother & Princess Margaret Nazi saluting. ] But a week ago, attendance again swelled to nearly 10,000 according to German media reports. The police no longer provides crowd estimates. Bachmann -- who was charged last week with inciting racial hatred by labelling asylum-seekers "animals", "trash" and "filthy rabble" -- was expected to again address the demonstration on Monday night.  [Germany's seriously f*cked.  Inciting racial hatred?  This is Nazi Germany all over again, in a politically correct guise that demands the destruction of Germany.  If this guy thinks a filthy rabble has descended on Germany, so be it.  But Germany operates as a totalitarian suppressive state, so he's being bent over & f*cked by his government -- the same government that is destroying his country.] As the crowd swelled to several thousand people, about three-quarters of them men and many waving Germany's national flag, police in about 10 vans looked on.  [Guess flag waving's also a 'disgrace' ... anywhere but maybe in Israel.  lol] A week ago PEGIDA supporters, who often condemn what they call the "liar press", assaulted a journalist.  [The press is poison.  It is full of sh*t.  Assaulted a journalist sounds interesting.  Was he harassing them?  Speaking of assaulting journalists, the Israeli authorities are repeat offenders.  lol] Supporters on Monday again yelled "we are the people", co-opting the slogan used by the pro-democracy protesters whose demonstrations a quarter-century ago preceded the fall of the Berlin Wall.  Co-opting?  [Well, the German government is co-opting Nazi Germany totalitarianism, so reviving the slogan of pro-democracy supporters is rather fitting in this case.] "I'm not a right-winger, but I'm scared," said Frank, 59, one of the few protesters who agreed to speak to AFP, on condition he not be fully named.  "I think of my children and grand children," he said, voicing fears about the "Islamisation" of his country. "We fought for our freedom 25 years ago, we have to demonstrate again. "I am OK with welcoming sick and wounded refugees, but in the TV images we can see young men. Those are economic refugees," he added. Uwe Friedrich, 46, said he had been with PEGIDA since the start, and wanted Muslims to leave the country. He was waving a sign that read: "We have a right to our German homeland and German culture".  [Fair enough.  Germany is for Germans.  Just like Kenya is for Kenyans and Pakistan is for Pakistanis.] Another placard quoted Hungary's hardline Prime Minister Viktor Orban, who recently described the refugee influx as "a German problem" -- with the placard adding the question "where are the life rafts for our children?" Another, more ominous sign read: "Resistance has become a duty against our country's destruction by Merkel & Co". http://news.yahoo.com/thousands-attend-german-rally-against-refugee-influx-194146372.html ---------------------- ꕤ ---------------------- COMMENT That it's even mention worthy that some guy from the Pegida organisation posed as Hitler for a gag photo at the hairdressers quite some time after the fact tells you this is about smearing the organisation -- as does the description 'far-right'.  They're not a far-right organisation.  They're normal people who don't want their country destroyed.  But if they were, what of it?  The right is as legitimate as the left, if not moreso considering that the left is no longer about socialism, even as it pretends to be socialist.  And the left's certainly not about nationalism in any shape whatsoever.  It no longer represents the native working classes. Notice the different set of rules for the British royals, who aren't being denounced by the press at every mention or being asked to step down because of Nazi family film footage and a penchant for Nazi dress-ups. At least there's still some spirit left in a section of the German population that is banding together to stand against the invasion of their nation. I feel so sorry for the German people.  As they say, where's the life rafts for their children. Germany is being destroyed by their corporate serving politicians. The German people deserve better than this. Just take a look at the violence in France.  Europe doesn't need that or sharia gangs on the streets, like in the UK.  These people do not belong in Europe. French SWAT teams should be given machine guns. ꕤ

Europe - Organised Mass Immigration Invasion

ꕤ Article SOURCE http://www.bbc.com/news/uk-scotland-scotland-politics-34447677 Scottish minister Humza Yousaf helps Syrian refugees on Greek island Scotland's international development minister Humza Yousaf has described how he witnessed "utter chaos" as he helped Syrian refugees off a boat. The politician was on he Greek island of Lesbos to see what help was being given to those coming ashore. Mr Yousaf said an estimated 5,000 people had arrived on the island in the 24 hours he was there. [...] "The first thing that hits you when you see the coast is the thousands, if not tens of thousands, of life jackets piled up on the shores." [...] http://www.bbc.com/news/uk-scotland-scotland-politics-34447677 ---------------------- ꕤ ---------------------- COMMENT Humza Yousaf has pledged that Scotland will take 2,000.  Yousaf is a member of the Scottish National Party.  Centre-left.   The article refers to women and children.   Sounds like BBC propaganda.  For starters they refer to 'Syrian refugees.'  But the majority are from all over the planet. And, for the most part it's able bodied young men that are descending on Europe.  Young guys that should be defending or rebuilding their countries.  So what's with the 'women and children' now? I also call bullshit on the 'people smugglers'. This is an organised operation -- and we're not talking people smugglers of the profit-making kind. This is being funded by someone:  it's the UN, EU, USA, Soros or someone.   Hey, it could be Saudi Arabians.  Saudis are really keen on mosque building & spreading the fundamentalism in Europe. Either that, or it's the CIA.  Russia would be vulnerable from the both the west and the south if there's a caliphate established in Europe. Aside from the massive numbers, the clue is: "The first thing that hits you when you see the coast is the thousands, if not tens of thousands, of life jackets piled up on the shores." 'People smugglers' my ass. As if people smugglers -- ie criminals making a fast buck -- provide life-jackets. ꕤ

Germany's Been Lying About Figures

ꕤ Article SOURCE http://www.freepressjournal.in/germany-expects-1-5-mn-asylum-seekers-this-year-report/ Germany expects 1.5 mn asylum-seekers this year: report — By PTI | Oct 05, 2015 08:38 pm Berlin: Germany could receive up to 1.5 million asylum-seekers this year, according to the Bild newspaper, quoting a confidential document containing estimates that are far higher than publicly released official figures. Authorities have so far predicted that Europe’s top economy would record between 800,000 and one million new arrivals in 2015. But Bild quoted the document saying that the authorities were now expecting to receive 920,000 new arrivals in the coming three months alone, bringing the total number of asylum-seekers this year to 1.5 million. “The migratory pressure will increase. For the fourth quarter, we expect between 7,000 and 10,000 illegal entries a day,” according to extracts of the document, although Bild did not specify its source. “The significant number of asylum-seekers risks becoming an extreme burden for the regions and communes,” added the document. The newspaper also quoted the document estimating that each asylum-seeker who successfully obtained refugee status could bring on average “four to eight” family members to Germany. On the basis of the preliminary forecast of 920,000 migrants, some “7.36 million people” could therefore have the right to move to Germany due to family ties. Interior ministry spokesman Harald Neymanns would not confirm the figures, noting however that the onset of winter could slow the surge in arrivals – as shown in previous years. “We are still expecting the migration pressure to drop in the winter months,” he said. Government spokesman Georg Streiter said he was not aware of the document’s existence. Chancellor Angela Merkel has been lauded worldwide for her decision to open Germany’s doors to refugees fleeing war and misery.  [They haven't been reading what I've been reading about Merkel.  lol] But within Germany, her popularity is starting to wane as local authorities struggle to cope with the massive task of hosting the record surge in refugees. http://www.freepressjournal.in/germany-expects-1-5-mn-asylum-seekers-this-year-report/ ---------------------- ꕤ ---------------------- COMMENT I can't stop looking at this.   It's like a horrific car accident.  It freaks me out.  But I can't stop looking. It's like those horror movies where plagues of things are taking over.   But I can't stop looking and freaking. I call bullsh*t even on those figures.  I calculated a horrific figure of just under 6 million per annum, at the rate they're passing through Skopje in a 12-hour period. Then add the extended family to that. ꕤ

Academic Predicts Clash of Civilisations in Europe

ꕤ Article SOURCE http://www.jpost.com/Middle-East/The-European-refugee-crisis-will-not-end-well-says-Israeli-professor-415503 The European refugee crisis will not end well, says Israeli professor By MICHELLE MALKA GROSSMAN 09/07/2015 18:28 The developed countries of the world are scrambling to come up with a solution to the refugee problem but one Israeli geostrategist does not see an end in sight. Professor Arnon Soffer, head of Geostrategy at the University of Haifa, told the The Jerusalem Post on Monday that the current refugee crisis is a result of uneven population growth around the world, which he expects to only get worse. He said that as populations in poor countries around the world continue to explode, European birthrates continue to decline. The continent of Europe is "committing suicide" for allowing its own population to decline so much, he said, calling it a culture that "would rather have cats and dogs than children," which he joked was similar to Tel Aviv. He used the continent of Africa as an example. With around one billion people currently living on the continent and another half million expected in the next, decade, Soffer does not think it will be possible to create the necessary infrastructure, water systems, medical clinics and schools to accommodate everyone. This, he said, will force more and more people to seek asylum elsewhere. [*that should probably read 'another half BILLION' expected in next decade, otherwise it doesn't make sense.] "[Building the infrastructure] in another 10 years? Mission impossible," Soffer said. "They will head for one [place]: Europe." He said that though countries like Germany are welcoming in refugees with open arms and need more young people, they may face a backlash from their own populace who want to maintain local culture. However, he said that the  Muslim population in Europe is not interested in assimilating and that this will only worsen as more arrive. "Europe potentially can open its doors and accept more and more refugees, but if Europe says no, I can understand because they are afraid [of] the Muslims," he said. "This is a clash of civilizations and it will not happen in Africa or Asia. It will happen in France, Hungary and will eventually reach England and Germany." He criticized what he called the hypocrisy of Europe, touting peace and liberty, while the "bloody navies of Europe" turn back refugees coming by sea, letting them drown in the Mediterranean, or allowing them to suffer on land with nowhere to go. Soffer does not believe that Israel should accept more Syrian refugees, in contrast to calls by some Israeli politicians and Palestinian Authority President Mahmoud Abbas. He noted that it is a desirable place because it is the only developed country in the region that refugees can reach by foot. However, he said Israel is too small of a place to absorb refugees. "We are a very small country," Soffer said. "We [have been] at continuous war for the past 67 years. Sixty percent of Israel is a military landscape. Sixty percent is desert and please leave me some space for additional Jews to come. So this is the story of Israel and we cannot be as generous as everyone expects us to [be]. No, we cannot do it. Soffer said there is no way to stop what he referred to as a "Tsunami Wave" of asylum seekers coming to Europe and does not expect a solution in the near future due to the global scale of the problem. "We are Western and [taught] by Hollywood that everything must have a happy ending. I do not see a happy end."  http://www.jpost.com/Middle-East/The-European-refugee-crisis-will-not-end-well-says-Israeli-professor-41550 ---------------------- ꕤ ---------------------- FINLAND 4 Oct 2015 ꕤ